Play composed, or wild?
I think a few BYU fans were happy with the level of excitement the Cougars had on Saturday. For most fans it was refreshing to see the Cougars with a little bounce in their step, especially at home -where things became derailed in earlier weeks. While the fire and excitement was appreciated, are there negatives that come with that added swagger?
My concerns stem from earlier performances against FSU and TCU. Where I have no doubts about the teams preparation or level of intensity. No matter who you are as a player, when the lights turn on and you crowd stands up, your blood is pumping and your emotions are high. I am not concerned about the emotion of the game, but more how that emotion is harnessed to produce a win. I am know going to say something that no BYU fan wants to hear….YES I do think it is sometimes necessary to rein in a players emotions. I do think that certain positions on the field need to exercise levels of restraint when playing in a big time rivalry game. The main reason is maintaining a level of composure and focus. I have personally only met a couple of players who could go buck wild before a game and still remained focused. Those types of players are few and far between.
For me the extra emotion didn’t manifest in my outward actions, but rather with a sense of focus and calm. I understood who I was as a player and I understood my role and responsibility to the defense. The recognition of the type of player I was helped me remain focused and unchangeable when playing UNLV or UTAH. I simply brought the same attitude each week.
BUT, I also understand that each team need a crazy S.O…gun that has no restraint on the amounts of emotion they can display. Those types have their place on the field and without them there would be no unsportsmanlike penalties and consequently no fire or emotional intrigue involved in the games.
In my personal opinion most of the players on BYU’s team are the focused and composed types of players. But I also think BYU will rely on players like Max Hall, Manase Tonga, O’Neal Chambers, Logan, Andrew Rich, Scottie Johnson, Jan Jorgenson, Harvey Unga, Dennis Pitta, and Andrew George to show a little more emotion -for some of these players it will be difficult, not as natural, but non the less important. Not too much emotion needs to be on display, but enough to insure that the BYU underclassmen and the team in red and white understand, these Cougars have rewritten the BYU history books and it should not go unnoticed or disrespected.
I am excited for the rivalry game. In every way I regret that I was unable to participate in my final rivalry game. I would have substituted just about any game during my career to play in one more game against Utah. A game with “meaning” is more exciting, more intense and more unpredictable. Personally I hope the game is close. I hope it comes down to BYU needing to make a play to win the game. Those moments are when players are defined and remembered. Who could forget Coach Doman’s legacy against Utah, or Luke Staley’s moments, Jenaro’s interception or Aaron Fransico playing his last game against Utah with a torn MCL. I would expect similar moments this weekend. If there isn’t, well…then I guess a win will do.
If we went by position, I’d want to see our linebackers, safeties and 9 of 11 special teams players go beserk. (The other two special teams players should be “safeties” and they need to be assignment sound so that the Utes don’t run one back). Wouldn’t mind a late hit or two or even a personal foul leading with the helmet from this group. Nothing dirty, but it’s a fine line between letting the Ute skill players know you’re there and getting a penalty.
I’d want the corners to just keep doing what they’ve been doing all season and fly a bit under the radar.
I’d want Manase to take out some aggression on a LB or two, a la Fui.
I want to see the coaches get a little animated. Some clapping, a Tiger Woods fist pump, body bump, helmet slapping, that sort of thing.
I’d like JJ and other underclassmen (Chambers, Jacobsen) to stay focused and not get too overzealous. They need to make sure they hold on to the ball, catch any ball they get their hands on and read the route correctly so Max doesn’t get picked off.
Likewise, offensive and defensive linemen need to concentrate, not get penalized (offsides, false starts, late hits, holding) so that we maintain momentum. They should be spending all of their effort controlling the trenches that they don’t really show much emotion except for after a sack or tackle for loss.
And I’d like Max to make his pupils laser-focused and throw strikes all over the field so that Robert Johnson doesn’t know where the ball is going next and can only wish he ended his Utah career after last season.
I want Riley Nelson to get in there for a 3rd and 3 wildcougar play and get the offensed pumped a bit. He’s the only underclassman that should be allowed to show emotion.
But more than anything I’d love to see a silent and dejected Ute bench when the clock hits zero.
Ki
I would love to see a BYU win but I don’t think it is going to happen:
Okay so here goes. In this post I am going to state my opinion on what I think is going to happen this Saturday in the Holy War.
Well, even though I am a die hard, bleed blue, cougar fan I think Utah, I know, I know; will win this game: Here is my score prediction: Utah 28 BYU 17. This is bad since I have nailed every prediction this year except for the FSU game. Yes I pick BYU to beat OU by 3 so I was close. Here is why Utah wins:
1- Wynn has an arm and can throw the ball deep. He can stretch the field big time and that is bad for our D. A lot like SDSU and we know what SDSU did against our pass defense. I see Wynn having a career day. He will be over 70% completion percentage and over 400 yards in passing.
2- Football speed/athletes. Utah has it and we really don’t. Utah will be the second best defense we go against in terms of football speed and great athletes; plus, on offense they are fast as well. They are very solid both with the pass and the run game and they will flat-out out run us.
3- Preparation and adjustments: I give the edge to Whitt and his staff here. It seems like he and his staff game plan very well and make great in game adjustments. In game adjustments. Man I wish we could do that if you now what I mean? Utah will be better prepared physically, mentally and emotionally for the game. BYU just seem to be very weak mentally and emotionally this year and we just don’t seem to prepare well for big games and Whitt is the king at getting his team ready for big games. The post game will be full of the same stuff we heard after the TCU and FSU game in that the players will be saying they came out flat and underprepared. I hate this more than anything!
4- The wildcat or whatever Utah calls it will kill us. We have never been able to stop it for some reason. Plus, Utah will pull out some trickeration that will kill us. I see a Utah running back throwing for a TD, a couple of reverses for big yards, a fake punt, etc…
5- Anae’s play calling. I see us starting the game with a very strong running game and then Anae going away from it quickly. We have all seen this time and time again. I believe we will be all left scratching our heads about Anae and his play calling but this is nothing new for us BYU fans. Anae, single handly will take Unga out of the game.
6- Jaime Hill: Like Anae he will leave us all scratching our heads about his defensive plan, play calling and lack of in game adjustments. He, like Anae, has a tendency to go away from what works very quickly. We will have little to no pressure on Wynn and he will have all day to pick us apart deep down the field. We will not record more than one sack, and put very little pressure if any on Wynn and our DBs will get worked by the faster and more athletic skill position players of Utah.
7- 3rd and 4th down conversions. I see Utah drives going like this. Very little yards running on 1st and 2nd down but Utah converting a high percentage of the time on 3rd and long with a long pass play. I see Utah converting 60% of their 3rd downs.
8- Kicking game. Utah is good and we are not and we all know it. I, like most fans, can’t wait for Payne to be gone. He will miss most of his field goal attempts and will have at least one kickoff go out of bounds.
9- Panic button: I see this game being close at halftime with BYU with the lead. As we all know, we are terrible coming out for the 3rd quarter. I know in the first 8 games we had 4 punts, 3 interceptions and a fumble in our first drives of the second half. That is not good at all!! I see Utah getting the momentum in the 3rd quarter because of their halftime adjustments and our lack of halftime adjustments. Because of this Anae will completely abandon the run game and we all know what happens to Hall in this situation. I don’t see any turnovers in the first half but I see 3 in the 3rd quarter (2 interceptions and 1 fumble all at the hands of Max Hall). This will be the key point in the game that will give Utah the win. Utah will win the 3rd quarter and thus the game.
10- This team can’t handle success at all and we all know it. Every time we have a good game we play flat the next week (ie, FSU after Tulane and UNM after Wyoming). The two worst things that could have happened to our team this week were to move up in the rankings and be picked to win by 7 by Vegas. That sucks! Our chances of winning would have gone up dramatically if Utah was picked to win and we had dropped in the rankings. I don’t know why but this team, and this was true last year, can’t handle even a little success and this will be our down fall this weekend.
11- We don’t play for 60 full minutes and Utah does. We have had one game this year were we played ever minute of a game and that was vs. Wyoming. This is why Utah beat us in 05 and we had to have heavenly intervention to win in 06 and 07.
On paper we should have destroyed Utah in O5, 06 and 07 but we lost one in overtime and, like I said earlier, we had to have miracles to win in 06 and 07. We are the better team this year but because of the 11 reason above we will lose by 10.
Here is a quote for an article about Utah and Coach Whitt that sums up why Utah will win on Saturday:
“Utah is an excellent team again and is so good in big games. Whittingham is a master at pushing the right buttons to rev up his troops, so motivation won’t be the issue.”
Well motivation, preparedness in all aspects (physical, emotional and mental) will be our issue. We will have more penalties, especially personal fouls.
I think we can all look forward to another year of Ute fans having the bragging rights and that is not fun at all for us Cougar fans.
On that note, I am happy with the season. I am not one of those Cougar fans that has a short-term memory. I will take a 9 and 3 regular season over the Crowton era any day of the week. I am sad for Max Hall. He will be one of the only Senior QB’s in BYU history not to improve much his senior year. He is a good man and a good QB. I just don’t think he will go down in history as one of the greats because of 6 games (TCU, Utah and Arizona in 07 and FSU, TCU and Utah this year). He will be know as a guy that won a lot of games but never could put it together against the top competition and Saturday will prove this.
Well I still love my Cougars and I am not looking forward to another year of hearing it from all the Utes in my ward/stake!!
You hit a home run. I would only add one thing, when that clock hit’s 0 the world stops and all cougar fans can see the look on every Ute’s face for about ten seconds. And then the celebration begins.
Oh ye of little faith.
Wow, Shawn, that was the longest reply I’ve ever read.
My opinion on the topic, I think we need to play with intensity. I think there’s a big difference between “going beserk” on the field, and playing with a higher level of passion/intensity. I think we need to hit a little harder, run a little harder, block a little harder, etc. this week.
I’ve been doing a lot of thinking this week thus far on my real thoughts on how this game might play out, and here’s what I’ve decided is my prediction:
I think Utah is going to get some early momentum with a big play. Utah always seems to put together a great offensive gameplan against the Y, and I think Wynn may connect with Reed on a bomb. What I worry about is whether or not we can play composed and not freak out over being down early.
But, I think we will stay composed. I think this game is going to go deep into the 4th and then our Defense is going to come up with a key stop to end a possible game winning drive by the Utes. My prediction for final score: BYU 24 – Utah 20.
I’m stressing about the game this week big time. I really, really…..REALLY want this one for my team. GO COUGARS!!
1) Home field advantage–I know it hasn’t been as dominant as before, but it still has to account for something right?
2) Wynn–We don’t know if he is a gamer. Sure, he might perform great Saturday, but he hasn’t done done anything with this ammount of pressure on him. He isn’t as mobile as Dalton or Ponder. And he doesn’t have the run game Utah had last year.
3) Dennis Pitta–Remember he was hurt before last year’s game? He should be a big help now, and Hall hopefully doesn’t have to rely on the outside receivers like he did last year. He has to have a big game.
4) The Cougs will be ready for the trick plays–They’ve already been burned enough with those in the past couple of years, I’m sure it’ll be a big focus in preperation this week (right Quinn?)
@Shawn: You are either a troll or a sackless, pathetic excuse for a Cougar fan.
I’m going to go with troll.
Don’t feed the trolls…
Yet, I have say the following:
In 06 we marched right down the field for the go ahead touchdown. The Ute defense couldn’t stop us. Then Utah blew their coverage of Harline and Beck through a, frankly, incredible pass across his body, while on the run. Just because we call it “The Prayer” and many of us were praying, doesn’t necessarily mean it really was Divine intervention.
In 07 Utah, once again, blew their coverage of Collie. After we got the first down, we still had to continue down the field and score. We did when Harvey ran over the Ute defense. Again, we only talk about Divine intervention because of what Collie said afterward.
It must really gall Utah fans either way: 1. BYU does get Divine help, which means that God does care about football and helped BYU, NOT Utah or 2. BYU outplayed Utah. Maybe it’s a bit of both, which would probably gall Utah fans even more (smile).
This year, if BYU executes and plays focused like Quinn says, we win, and I predict we win big (i.e. by 10+ points). If not, then I think that game will be a toss-up. I will take a win either way.
Senior QB vs. Freshman QB
In the end, that will make all the difference.
Statistically things look good in our favor. I’m not sure where some are getting the idea that Utah has so many more athletes than we do?
The fact is that, other the UNM game, all of our wins over conference opponents were by a larger margin of victory than Utah. Overall, we have scored more than Utah and our defense has given up about the same number of points per game.
I’m not sure what to say about the FSU game. I have some faint hope that they are really better than their record states and that they will beat Florida this week (I know, I know . . . “when pigs fly”).
The TCU games are tough to analyze. It is encouraging that we “only” gave up 38 and Utah gave up 55 (only Texas State gave up more at 56). But it is concerning that we only scored 7 and Utah scored 28. My feeling is that Max was too tentative in that game because of all of the interception criticism. Since then, he has played more aggressively. Sure, QBs that thread the needle get picked, but that is what it takes to be #2 QB passing efficiency with 28 TDs.
All that goes out the window on Saturday. Anything could happen with these two teams. Both teams are solid top 25 teams in my view.
oops, I forgot my main point, which is a reply to the article.
Never underestimate adrenaline. It makes you run faster and hit harder. I don’t think it helps much for throwing or catching though. The key is to bring it out at key times and still stay in control – i.e. not do dumb things.
My opinion is that the key to the game is the defense. Max and his fantastic four running backs and his great WRs and TEs with a solid O-line (even though it isn’t very deep) will score points. I can’t see Utah’s defense shutting them down (not the same defense as last year). But which Cougar defense will show up? I’m hoping for the one that played OU, Tulane, UW, and AFA.
Wow Shawn, you sure “know” a lot of things. I just wish you “knew” spelling and punctuation.
As far as playing wild goes, I would love to see this from the defense. Most of them at least. It is much easier to run around like a psycho when you are defensive player than an offensive player. A little fire from the d-line would be great. We have got to get pressure on the freshman QB with the dirt on his upper lip. He has a good arm, but he also has 3 games under his belt. As stated in other replies, there needs to be control and focus by some key players on the d. These players need to play with emotion but also need to focus and keep everybody focused. We all know who these players are.
The offense I think needs to play with a bit with more control. The perfect example in my mind would be the first half against Air Force. The o line was giving Max all sorts of time and he played amazing for those two quarters. He was making great passes and great decisions. I liked the pace and the feel of those drives. They also used the no huddle quite a bit which I think is essential. This seems to work well for the Cougars. TCU did this much of the game vs. the Utes and it seemed to work well.
As most of us are, I am nervous for this game. But I always am. I can’t imagine what it would be like preparing and waiting for this game as a player. I believe in this team and am pumped! Go Cougars!
Quinn, I know this is unrelated to the article (or at best tangental to it), but would you mind reposting or at least putting as the lead article again John Beck’s account of the 2006 drive? I think that will help us all get in the spirit of rivalry week.
Shawn,
It’s one thing to be pessimistic about the outcome of Saturday’s game but I see so many inaccuracies and half truths in your talking points. The truth is nobody knows exactly how things will go down which is what makes it all exciting.
1. Wynn has an arm but he’s not Brett Favre. He’ll make some nice throws but he’s a freshman who will make some mistakes too as he has shown in the few games he’s played.
2. Utah has some fast guys but they’re no faster than they were last year or the year before. Our loss last year had little to do with their speed and I get sick of those guys on 1280 always bringing that game up as an example of BYU’s struggles with speed teams. If we lose, it’s not gonna be because they were faster than us.
3. I have no doubt Kyle will have his team ready to play but implying that BYU’s staff doesn’t do their homework is ridiculous. Utah lost just as many games as we have including a butt whipping from TCU. Some of the games they struggled in, we won easily and vice versa. I think we’re evenly matched here for the most part.
4. Utah has run wilcat formations at us for years and the results have been hit and miss. They might make a big play and they might not, but it’s not something that will have the defense pooping their pants when they see it.
5. Anae is not perfect and he makes mistakes but I get tired of fans him the whipping boy everytime our offense struggles. I thought out gameplan last year was fairly balanced. One of the reasons, we abandoned the run was the multiple turnovers and penalties put us in a hole where we had to play catch up offense and that’s when things went from bad to worse and Max went color blind.
6. Hill is a good coach who will come up with a solid game plan. He is someone with years of coaching experience more so than his Utah counterpart. Ultimately though it’s up to players on the field and how they fulfill their assignments and execute the game plan.
7. Unless you have a crystal ball, I don’t see any basis for this prediction.
8. I honestly haven’t paid much attention to Utah’s kicking game this year but I haven’t seen anything that special. Sakoda is not there anymore. Payne has been fairly reliable in short range FG’s. He’s not doing the kickoffs, Stephenson is and he hasn’t been too bad as of late.
9. It is true that we’ve struggled a little this year coming out of the gate in the 2nd half. With the exception of TCU and FSU, we’ve fared quite well in the 3rd quarter. In last year’s game, we started the 2nd half well before things went south. These games however are won in the 4th quarter however not the 3rd.
10. The team’s to “handle success” this season is a Monday morning quarterback argument that fans will analyze to death. I don’t see how that applies in this case. BYU knows this will be a tough game and you can guarantee the practices will be as intense.
11. I don’t know what criteria you’re basing the full 60 minutes thing on. Football is a game of momentum and in a competitive game it will swing back and forth in spite of whatever effort the team is putting in. The 2005 game was one that started badly for us but we rallied in the 2nd half to tie it and would’ve won it in regulation had Beck not overthrown Harline, but things happen. You could call the 06-07 games divine intervention but we won because we were the better team and had the mental toughness to get it done in crunch time.
I’m not under any illusions about the game, we could lose but I prefer not to count us out before the game has been played.
seasider – well said – especially regarding the coaches.
Seasider,
I hope you are right and I am wrong. I do have very little faith in our team in big games.
Now you said, “It’s one thing to be pessimistic about the outcome of Saturday’s game but I see so many inaccuracies and half truths in your talking points. The truth is nobody knows exactly how things will go down which is what makes it all exciting.”
My response to this is yes I am pessimistic about BYU in big games but how can ones opinions be inaccurate and half truths? Let me repost the first part of my novel post above:
“Okay so here goes. In this post I am going to state my opinion on what I think is going to happen this Saturday in the Holy War.”
The key words here are opinion and think. Here is what an opinion is:
1. a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.
2. a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.
There for I didn’t state any half truths or inaccuracies. I state my opinion and what I think will happen.
So I hope your opinions are right and mine are wrong and I will be the first to be on here to man up to it.
Also I love the fans that say one is a troll if they aren’t a blue tinter. That is always fun to read.
Go Cougs – Prove me wrong, PLEASE!!!
So in other words, you claim any fan is a blue tinter if they take exception to hand-wringing, skirt-wearing, pansy exclamations of “Oh, BYU is so bad at this and this and that, and the Utes are so good at this and this and that, however will we win?” I think not.
Expressing opinions about why you think BYU might lose the game is one thing. Categorically stating only negatives about BYU while simultaneously fawning over Utah is something else.
I repeat. You are either a troll or a sackless, pathetic excuse for a Cougar fan.
If it’s the former, nice try. If it’s the latter, man up and have some faith in your team.
Shawn,
You said you were merely stating opinions. How is you saying you “know” Utah will win the game.
“And I quote: Well, even though I am a die hard, bleed blue, cougar fan I think Utah, I know, I know; will win this game:”.
Doesn’t sound like an opinion at all.
Ben H – Ditto.
To the original post- I I have yet to see BYU have too much fire to lose control of the game. In their only losses this year, they were flat, lifeless, pathetic, BLAH! If BYU went out with tons of fire and played the entire game with the pick up they had on Saturday, flying off the handle, making rash decisions, having the burning in the busoms, and still lost, I would feel a whole lot better than I did when they the “intensity” and “composure” from the TCU or FSU games.
So, I say GO WILD! I want to see what they do. If it gets out of control, no doubt it’ll take Bronco two seconds to be a buzz kill. But I dare him to get fired up and show some emotion, too. Seeing his fists in the air in Texas was out of character, but somewhat good to know he is human.
And I have to say, no questions asked, BYU is a better team than Utah. Utah has not beat anyone of significance this year, and they barely beat Air Force, barely beat Wyoming, and they have a Freshman quarterback. I would not be surprised if the Cougars come out and pounce on the Utes, but we know Whittingham always brings a good fight, and will come back. Ultimately, I say BYU will win by a touchdown or less.
GO COUGARS!
drako,
What I meant by “I know, I know” was that it is lame for me as a BYU fan to pick Utah not that I know Utah will win. My bad. Should have used better English. No one knows who is going to win. That is why they play the game. And I don’t have any faith in this team to win a big game like this because of their performance vs. TCU, Utah and Arizona in 2008 and FSU and TCU this year.
As for Blue thru and thru. I can only laugh at you. Sorry but fan like you make me laugh. If a fan doesn’t meet your standards of fandom then they are a pathetic fan or a troll. That is just funny. IMO, faith has to be earned and this team has not earned mine in big games.
Shawn,
I don’t have a problem with your opinions as we’re all entitled to our own. My issue is that some of the statements and points you were making seemed to be based on things that I didn’t feel were completely accurate. I felt the need to play devils advocate so I hope you weren’t offended or anything. I guess we’ll find out on Saturday how things turn out. I’m optimistic but nervous given the history of this rivalry.
Well said, True Blue Chick,
I 100% agree with this:
“To the original post- I I have yet to see BYU have too much fire to lose control of the game. In their only losses this year, they were flat, lifeless, pathetic, BLAH! If BYU went out with tons of fire and played the entire game with the pick up they had on Saturday, flying off the handle, making rash decisions, having the burning in the busoms, and still lost, I would feel a whole lot better than I did when they the “intensity” and “composure” from the TCU or FSU games.
So, I say GO WILD!”
I remember after both the TCU and FSU games the players saying they came out flat and ill prepared. That is unacceptable!
So I am with you: Go Wild!! Lets see some Bronco fist pumping like for the OU game (by the way why did he stop doing this?).
I am for saying that certain games are more important than others and should be circled on the schedule.
Come on Cougs. Show some emotion and show some mental toughness and go win this game!!!
It has little to do with my “standards of fandom,” as you call it. I have no problem with a fan expressing concern about an upcoming game or discussing their perceived problems with the team.
Rather, it’s the sycophantic, obsequious, Ute-loving tone of your original post that I take exception to, especially during rivalry week. If you can’t see that in your post, then I suppose you can’t be helped. While I still think you’re probably a Ute troll, if you’re not, then you might want to consider becoming a Ute fan anyway, since you clearly think they are so awesome and BYU so inept.
And no need to apologize. If you think I give a rat’s hindquarters whether or not you think I’m funny, you’re wrong.
Seasider (by the way are you in Hawaii?)
No problem. No offense taken.
It is weird. In all my time I have never seen the BYU fan base so unconfident in their team but it is 100% understandable based on this teams history in big games.
I have a group of about 10+ guys that get together for the game every week here in Denver and I can say that in talking to each one of them in church on Sunday not one as the expectation they we will win for all the reasons I stated in my first long post.
I sure hope our team, through their performance on Saturday, can give us some hope.
Question: Do you think our program, from the coaches to the players are too heady? I think the Cougars are too heady. They worry too much. The problem is that they are too heady. They think too much, they worry too much; they let stuff get to them too much. That is why they look so bad against TCU and FSU imo. Be honest, as bad as UNM is this year, they had BYU believing they can play with them. It is the same reason BYU destroys AFA year in and year out, they are in their heads. The #4 defense in the nation in AFA looked lost against BYU but played TCU rather well. I believe TCU, Utah and any ranked team is in the Cougar’s heads. I’ll bet you all week BYU fretted and stewed over thinking TCU was a better team and although they are right, it got them so heady that they didn’t even show up, just like last year.
We are way too heady imo. We think about it to much. We let people get into our heads. I think this comes from Bronco and that trickles down to the team.
It is like when I played basketball. I was a shooting guard and when I caught the ball and went up and just shot it, it usually went in. But when I caught it and I thought about it I usually missed. From Bronco down it seems like the program has analysis paralysis if you know what I mean.
By the way, Utah and Whitt are great at getting inside BYU’s head and I am really worried about this and that is why we lost in 05 to an inferior team and had to have dvine intervention to win in O6 and 07 even though we where by far the better team and shoule have blown them out.
What think you?
It looks like Shawn has carefully cataloged every single mistake BYU has made over the past few years and now predicts a cosmic convergence of them all when we play Utah. Way to go, Shawn–you’ve presented a textbook course in pessimism.
But as to the subject, I think the contrast between BYU and Utah when playing each other is the main reason the subject of emotion and BYU comes up so frequently. It does seem that no matter how good Utah is in a given year they come into this game stoked to the max and manage to overachieve.
OTOH, I have seen BYU come out with great emotion and then shoot themselves in the foot. I don’t know what it is. Does Kyle have some magic secret or is it just a psychological monkey that we’ve got to get off our back? I really think it’s the latter.
Yes, Utah played us close in a couple of games where they shouldn’t have been able to stay with us. They also beat us badly a couple of years where we probably weren’t going to win but wish we’d at least have made a game of it like they did.
The emotion can help but it can also hinder. I think the most important thing is level-headed confidence. It’s time for us to have Utah’s number for a change and I’m predicting that with a senior QB and some pressure defense to rattle the freshman we’ll come out on top big this year. I’m guessing BYU 42 Utah 21.
While I don’t know any more than Shawn, I’ll have a much nicer week thinking of it this way and I won’t be any more disappointed if we lose. If we do, Shawn, feel free to rub it in.
I hope we blow them out!!! Don’t get me wrong I love to win the close ones and see the looks on the utes faces as victory is snatched from their reach. The reason I want a blow out is, we haven’t done it for a while and it would be nice to rub it in their faces. Second, I don’t know what it is about this game but my adrenalin gets going and I get all nervous. I guess that comes from seeing this rivalry game since the 70s. I don’t know if my heart can take it the older I get! Sooo BLOW OUT THE UTES!!!!!!!!
I know that the Cougars have had some up and down games this year, but I really don’t think they’re as hapless in big games as some fans make them out to be.
I don’t remember for sure about the FSU game, but I can say that with TCU that I didn’t think we fell apart at all. We were able to move the ball on them a lot of the time (we even had quite a few more yards than Utah did). We kept it fairly close in the first half. Bronco sometimes mentions that a game can turn on one or two plays, and I think the TCU game was no exception. When Max Hall threw the pass that bounced off Brian Kariya’s hands into the air for the interception and subsequent TCU score, it seemed to put the game out of reach when it could have been the beginning of a comeback. I’m not saying that TCU wasn’t the better team, because they were and are. But I think BYU is easily the second-best in the MWC this year, and that’s what will play out on Saturday.
Hey Rubb,
Thank you! I do when the nego my lego award this week.
I think Forrest Gump said it best.
I will make one change to what Forrest said,
“BYU football is like a box of chocolates, you just never know what you are going to get.”
Are we going to get the Max Hall of last year’s holy war or the Max Hall of UCLA last year? Are we going to get the BYU defense of OU, Wyoming and AFA or are we going to get the D from TCU, and FSU? Are we going to get the fist pumping Bronco of the OU game or the no emotion Bronco of TCU and FSU. Are we going to get the flat, unmotivated team that played UNM or the team that played OU and AFA? We just don’t know.
I think this is why 99% of BYU fans are worried and unconfident in winning this game this week. We just don’t know who is going to show up on Saturday.
BYU Football Program = Sybil Dorsset
Ps. For you young folks on here:
Sybil is a 1973 book by Flora Rheta Schreiber about the treatment of Sybil Dorsett (a pseudonym for Shirley Ardell Mason) for dissociative identity disorder (then referred to as multiple personality disorder) by her psychoanalyst, Cornelia B. Wilbur. The book was made into two movies of the same name, once in 1976 and again as a television movie in 2007.
Man can I spell today?
Sorry for spelling your name wrong Robb and also for typing when instead of win.
Well we all make mistakes right?
“Well we all make mistakes right?”
Absolutely. So let’s agree to give our boys in blue the same compassion if Sybil shows up.
Robb,
Don’t even say it!!
Sybil better not show up. 
Speaking from personal experience, adrenaline really can boost speed, strength, and sometimes even skill/level of execution. That being said, “going wild” usually isn’t a good thing. With the possible exception of part of the kickoff team, football players need to be able to think and react quickly and have their judgement clouded by distracting feelings. Geting pumped up is good. Personally I couldn’t help but be pumped up during games, but when one gets mad or angry or “wild,” bad things can happen.
Now as a fan I reserve the right to be as wild as I feel like : )
Go Cougars!
31-13
Why is it that so many fans think that BYU doesn’t show up for the big games?
The fact of the matter is that they do, but then when they win, many fans and detractors then say, “Oh, well, I guess it wasn’t a big game after all.” By that way of thinking, ALL of BYU’s losses were big games and ALL of their wins were no big deal. What a ridiculous way to judge the team. No team could live up to such standards.
Here is a list of the games, that I consider big games, that BYU has won since Bronco Mendenhall has been coach (note: I subscribe to the idea that ALL rivals, quality opponents, and bowl games are “big” games as well as any game in which BYU is the underdog):
2005
Wyoming – at the time everyone talked about their vaunted defense and how BYU would struggle. We shredded them 55-7
Air Force – blowout win
2006
TCU – we were significant underdogs, but we win handedly.
Wyoming – in a game that people thought would be close, again based on Wyoming’s defense, we win 55-7.
Air Force – solid win
Utah – beat Utah with “The Prayer” in a game in which Utah and BYU left everything on the field. This is the best kind of win.
Oregon – Huge win in a bowl game (at the time everyone was concerned it was going to be a close game and that BYU would possibly lose)
2007
Arizona – many fans expect us to lose, but we get a solid win
TCU – solid win
Air force – solid win
Utah – huge come-from-behind win
UCLA – we win our bowl game although we had played that same team earlier that year and lost.
2008
Washington – not everyone expects us to win and it is against a traditional PAC-10 power.
Air Force – win
UCLA – everyone thought it would be close, we win 59-0.
2009
Oklahoma – how in the world do people keep forgetting this game?!! Most were expecting BYU to get blown out (including myself).
Air Force – solid win
Another important thing that needs to be pointed out is that BYU, with the exception of 2005, has been CLUTCH in close games. BYU can only play the teams that are on their schedule. Their record against that schedule over the last 5 years should speak for itself. They do beat teams that they are expected to lose to AND they do have big wins. The problem is that many fans have totally unreal expectations. I say, “Enjoy the wins, forget the losses, support the team, and be optimistic.”
I am not nervous about this week’s game. I am anxious. The possibility exists that would could lose. That possibility exists in every game, but this year I can’t wait to play Utah. I hope that players feel the same way.
Mental toughness is such an “it” factor in sports. It is hard to learn and hard to teach. Some would tell you that you are born with it.
This team is not as mentally tough as some of our past teams. We take too much of our confidence from circumstances. If we come out and start the game better than we anticipated our play ramps up and we hang with tough teams or steam roll lesser teams.
If we encounter circumstances that we did not expect our confidence goes down and we begin to play flat, scared, play not to lose rather than play to win.
When we hung with OK the first few possessions you could see our confidence rise. We were getting to the ball quick and hitting hard. It looked like we were “going wild” as some have said already.
We need to be careful though how we define “going wild.” I think what we really want is to see the team play with confidence. I don’t think we are hoping they play with reckless abandon.
What separates good teams from great teams are those with players who have inner confidence regardless of the circumstances. I’m hoping our players are learning and building that inner confidence and that it will show up this weekend even if we do get down.
If things get tough and we are still playing hard and with confidence that is a good sign. If we start to press or look unsure it translates into being slow and flat.
This whole speed thing is so over rated. If utah has so much more speed than us then what happened at TCU? Confidence makes you look faster even if your 40 clock speeds are slow.
I say go Cougars. If we can get on a roll and confidence builds even a team without a lot of mental toughness can prevail. I’m hoping we have some adversity and Max finally shows some mental toughness to pull us back and put them down.
I’m a big BYU fan. With that said, I totally agree with Shawn. I still can’t get over how we lost in one of those 05,06,07 games to Utah with their second string quarterback in our own stadium. The thing I worry about the most with the Coug’s is their lack of strength in regards to the psychological/mental aspect of the game. I hope they can pull it off.
Shawn,
I understand now. Thanks for the explanation. My apologies for the misunderstanding. Have some faith. It will happen!
The difference (problem?) is that this team hasn’t had to fight through extended adversity. They’ve never lost 2 in a row, and their mentality seems to be that if they won, they don’t need to be as self-critical or motivated as if they lost (hey, I’m the same way.) So where Bronco’s early teams had to pull together to fight through to make good things happen, these later teams expect them to happen. I’m not saying it’s an entitlement issue, but there is a mental fortitude that comes from having to will yourself to overcome tough circumstances. So far the current teams haven’t shown they can will themselves back…at least not from multi-score leads.
Quinn, you were part of that first set of teams. In that era the quiet focus and bend-a-spoon-with-your-mind mental toughness was exactly what was needed. This is a different era. Maybe it needs a new mindset. Leading with fire might be what it takes to get to the next level. Maybe not. They’ll still be missing that iron will needed to stage comebacks.
They’re also afraid of failure, so the wheels fall off when things start to go a south. Instead of willing themselves back into it, they seem to say “oh shoot, I was afraid this might happen…” and things go from bad to worse.
In the end I think those are two different things: it takes willpower to go from a losing to winning. Fire gets you from neutral to winning/blowing people out. You need fire to jump to that next level. But without willpower, you’re in danger of losing big.
oceanographer:
I am usually pretty easy going on boards with other people’s post but I just don’t understand yours at all.
A big game is a victory over a ranked team. BYU is slammed in all sports outlets as not having beat a team that is ranked at the end of the season. That is a big game, a win over a ranked team.
Lets go through the wins by year that you listed as big wins:
2005:
Wyoming finished the season 4 and 7 and we didn’t blow them out. Their good to average defense was in 2006. We won this game 35 to 21
AFA ended the season 4 and 7 as well.
Both these games were no where near quality wins agains good teams. They were both mediore to horrible teams in 2005.
2006:
TCU: Yes a quality big game win. TCU ended the season ranked 22nd in the AP.
Wyoming: They were terrible like always. Beating Wyoming is not a quality win at all. They finished 6 and 6.
AFA was 4 and 8 and not good at all. Not a quality win
Utah finished 8 and 5 and unranked. Good win, always is when you beat your rival but not close to a big win/quality win.
Oregon: Great game. Loved it but Oregon was a middle of the road PAC 10 team that finished 7 and 6 and unranked.
2007:
Arizona finshed 5 and 7 and was a terrible team.
TCU: Good win but not a big game quality win. Was not ranked and finshed 8 and 5
AFA: 9 and 4 so this was a good win but not a big game/quality win
Utah: Was 9 and 4 and unranked. Alway good to beat Utah but not a quality win.
UCLA: Mediocre PAC 10 team that finished the season with a losing record of 6 and 7.
2008
Washington: Are you kidding me? Probably the worst team in all of college football. They finished the season 0 and 12. THEY DIDN’T WIN ONE GAME. Come on man!
Air Force: 8 and 5, unranked and pretty mediocre.
UCLA: What? UCLA was horrible in 2008. Finished the season 4 and 8.
2009
Oklahoma: I would call this a quality win but most people wouldn’t since OU is ending up the season pretty mediocre at best.
Air Force – solid win but not a quality win.
The only chance we have left for a quality big game win is Utah. They are ranked and will probably finish the season ranked.
So BYU has one true quality win vs a team that ended the season ranked and that was TCU in 2006. OU is close but doesn’t meet the definition of a big game quality win but still a great win.
Most of the games you listed were wins over very mediocre to bad teams.
I sure hope we can notch a quality win on Saturday.
Shawn and Ocean,
It really boils down to a definition of quality win. If you are talking beating ranked opponents, we all know that our record against ranked opponents is quite horrific.
Prior to Oklahoma:
1. We had lost 12 CONSECUTIVE GAMES to ranked nonconference opponents.
2. We were 2-13 against AP Top 25 teams since 1999 (the TCU win was one of them).
3. Last ranked nonconference neutral field win was #14 Kansas St in Cotton Bowl (1997).
4. Last top 10 nonconference win was 1990 against Miami.
So, if you are defining quality wins as beating RANKED NONCONFERENCE OPPONENTS, you’re not going to get many.
If you’re going to define quality wins as beating BCS schools, you’ll get a little more.
And, if you’re going to define quality wins as Bronco and the team does (any win is a quality win), then you’ll have several seasons worth.
Even though the conference opponents are not ranked, there is something to be said about playing the same team and the same coach each year. There is a familiarity between the programs and I think this makes those games tougher than they should be. This is why Boise St can have trouble with, say, a San Jose St.
An interesting exercise is to apply your criteria to other teams, say Boise St, Utah and TCU. Their 2009 seasons aren’t chock full of “quality wins”, either… Their history, however, has GOT to be better than ours; I’m too lazy to research that.
Ki
BTW, we are 1-1 against ranked opponents this year. If we beat Utah we will be 2-1 and I don’t know if we’ve ever had a winning record against ranked opponents. I know, I know, I’m reaching. My overall point is that seasons don’t have to end with a BCS or other bowl victory to be counted as a success. Lose our next 2 games and we are 9-4, kind of a let down, but not terrible. Win and we finish 11-2, which is quite stellar, actually.
How wonderful would it be if BYU just went in there and blew out Utah? I mean, just drilled them? Wouldn’t that be such a nice change of pace?
Oh well, a guy can dream….
Wow, this thread has gone _way_ off topic, so let’s bring it back: Proper emotion is essential to sustained success. Look at how fired up TCU was against us and the Utes, did they play with emotion? Yes. Can you sustain success when you’re blinded by crazy bezerker bloodlust? Not likely.
The team needs to play like they did at Wyoming or last week against AFA. Someone should have been stationed in the locker room after the game with a ShopVac, sucked up all that good juju into a bottle and saved it to crack open just before the game this Saturday.
As for all the cerebral back-and-forth smack about who’s gonna win and why; isn’t this why we play games? If you want to figure out who the best team is then lace up you cleats and go for it. When the 60 minutes are up look at the scoreboard. Sports are simply beautiful and beautifully simple like that.
As for the “quality wins” garbage; leave that for the BCS believers. That’s the only way the BCS has sustained it’s bigoted two-tiered system in the first place. I for one can’t stand it, I think it’s brainwashed all of us into thinking that one team’s win is better than another, hence you ARE a better team. No, NO, NO! sports were created to give us a definitive answer to the question. Play the team to find out. If you’re good enough you’ll win (see BSU vs OK and BSU vs TCU).
Wow look at me vent – sorry the bloodlust took over…
Shawn,
It was my mistake on the 2005 year, I was looking at the 2006 Wyoming game where we won 55-7.
Kiyoshige points out pretty clearly the difference between our definitions of quality wins. I don’t have a problem with your setting it as ranked opponents and I can see your point. My initial responses to you were because, like it or not, your post was exactly like the kind that a troll would post. I apologize for so labeling you now that I know better.
I do think that there is a Catch-22 in defining quality wins the way that you do. Many teams that we have beaten could very well have become ranked or ended ranked had we not beaten them. TCU in 2007 is an example of this. Other things also change. Yes, Washington went 0-12, but only after losing their starting quarterback. Oklahoma is another example. At the time we beat them Oklahoma was a far better team than they are now. We took out their Heisman-trophy winning quarterback and a huge chunk of their emotional drive since a National Championship was their main goal and we ended it. The same thing with UCLA. How tough is it to get up again after such a blowout loss (Staff, Quinn, and/or Ben, any thoughts on that?). I can accept that my opinion is wrong, but I think that there are just so many intangibles that can affect the outcome of a season to be negative about your team because it doesn’t win every game or loses to most ranked opponents. When BYU starts losing regularly to unranked (FSU notwithstanding) opponents, then I will get negative.
I don’t care too much about the 2-13 record against ranked opponents. I care more about the 2-8 record of the Bronco Era. Here’s to being 3-8 after Saturday.
BYU’s bowl record before Bronco was 7-15-1 (50%) after this year.
I just have been very frustrated this year with all of the complaints about the team and Bronco and Max, etc. Having watched BYU for a long time I see the present as being as good as it has ever been and things are getting better (even with a loss to Utah last year and the lack of a conference crown this year). The evidence for that is just how many records were broken during the same game (!) this last week. These records are coming at a time when BYU is playing much stronger opponents too. Over the last 5 years we, as fans, have had the opportunity to see some of the greatest players to ever play for BYU. I don’t think that BYU’s golden era is only something of the past. We’re in one right now.
Somehow my other bowl statistics were lost: It should have said:
…7-15-1 (50%) after this year.
My bowl stats didn’t work again (probably something to do with my use of the percent sign). Anyway, my basic point is that things have definitely improved under Bronco.
Go Cougs, I just hope they come ready to battle. If they do that, they have a good chance to dominate and win
Two great things have happened this year. First, Max has really stepped up and I’m proud of him.
Second, it’s been a while since I’ve heard the BYU band play the Popcorn Popping song. I’m hoping that’s permanent because if they do it during the Utah game, as they often do, I’m going to start ringing their skinny necks.
Do I sound hostile? Yeah, it’s that time of year.
A few thoughts about what I am reading:
One: I’m a pretty smart guy. I can even beat my computer at Scrabble. But, I need to look up “sycophantic” and “obsequious.” Those aren’t regular football words.
Two: I think too many Ute fans and a few players are genuine low-class morons. Beating Utah is important. It’s more important than winning, or even playing in a bowl game, even a BSCS bowl game.
Three: Quinn what are you thinking? I want BYU to have to make a play to get a first down. I want the Cougars to have to pull out the stops to score a TD. But I want the game to be something like 83 to 7. I want our guys to blow the doors off of LES and then next year do the same at RES. I want the Utes to be humiliated and the fans silenced into obscurity.
Hey, I’m okay with them beating Michigan or Alabama. But when it comes to this game, I want nothing good to come to the color red. The thing is, I can’t stand the Utes.
If some of you don’t agree…whatever. We all have our right to love our neighbor and extend brotherly kindness into the fray of the Rivalry Week. As for me, maybe I’ll just rot in Hell for my hatred of the Utes. Well, many of them. It’s not a hatred of all Ute fans, many of whom as I said, are actually fine people. But I do have an institutional hatred for the what Ute Crimson has come to stand for and those who perpetuate its vile personality. So yep, I hate the Utes and I’m willing to live with the consequences when I stand to be judged.
Feel free to differ. Feel free to think of football as no more competitive than 9-year old girls soccer. Feel free to invoke the Golden Rule, quote scripture, pontificate about neighborliness and the missionary spirit. Say what you want. Be what you want. As for me and my house, we bleed Cougar Blue and I hate the Utes.
Doug
For those of you who enjoyed Beck’s writeup from last year, he has another good one on Harline’s blog.
http://jonnyharline13.blogspot.com/2009/11/special-guest-john-beck.html
Play composed and confident – not wild. When I said this team lacked mental toughness I realize that sounded harsh. This is a very good team and the last 4 years have been as good or better than we have seen in the history of Cougar football.
I agree with BlueGoggles – we are now in a stage of having to learn how to play with too much success. Wouldn’t have it any other way and I am sure Bronco and Co. will figure that out soon enough.
I love what Bronco is trying to do on and off the football field and I even think he is a better coach than LaVell and I loved LaVell.
But Max and his team do struggle to come from behind. Once they are down they seem to be mentally beat. In past years we lost more games and had some blowouts as well but when Detmer or Young or some of those teams in the past got down and were being humiliated you still had this thought in your mind that they could come back – that it was still possible.
This team gets down and for some reason that feeling of being able to come back isn’t there.
That can change and hopefully it will on Saturday. Not having to come back and blowing out the red team would be the best option.
Go Cougars and thanks to Quinn and the rest for the best Cougar info site on the internet.
Doug…… AMEN BROTHER!!!!!
well said Nate
to: Nectar
what are you talking about? I’m pretty sure we won in 2006 and 2007. Remember “Harline is still open” and “4th and 18″?
Some fans (probably those that have never played or coached much) have this unrealistic expectation of the mental side of the game. I remember my losses as a player and as a coach and I can honestly say that in most cases we lost because the other team was better and/or because lady luck (usually turnovers) wasn’t in our favor that day.
I can remember being somewhat mystified when press/fans would talk about us not preparing adequately or not being mentally prepared. That is bull in most cases. I guarantee you that BYU is working in overdrive getting ready for this game both physcially and mentally. If they lose it won’t be because of that.
Don’t care about close games. I just want BYU to slaughter those Utes–Slaughter!
It continues to pain me to hear this crap about “effort” and “energy” and “going berserk” and that the only time BYU lost was because they came out flat. That’s circular reasoning: they lost because they came out flat, and they came out flat because they lost… so therefore, the only thing we need (forget about a gameplan that attacks the opponents’ weaknesses, preparation in order to read their coverages and offensive sets well, etc.) is to not come out flat. We come out non-flat, and we win, because if we win, we were non-flat.
Rubbish, Cougar Nation… Didn’t you read Quinn’s article????? True blue, adrenaline also makes you jittery and more likely to focus on your first emotion, which often is what the opposition wants you to do–that’s the whole deception thing (don’t go there, now…)
The adrenaline and fire are something that you need to get over so that you can focus on knowing your responsibilities and performing within the system. At this point in the season, we’re not going to see trickeration from the Cougar coaches, so we have to rely on their scheme–and if the players don’t execute the scheme, we definitely lose. If they perform well… then we make a game of it.
Shawn (and I’m not so self-deceptive (that word again??) to think that anyone who looks realistically at a situation is a troll), I think some of your points are valid. However, Payne hasn’t been that bad, we have actually done quite well this year against wildcat plays, and that whole speed thing AGAIN???? That’s almost as bad as the whole energy crap! Air Force Air Force Air Force. They have no speed, but they managed to do reasonably well this year against some stiff competition. Now I will say that the two most worrisome things to me are that you’re right, Anae gets away from the run too often (though in his defense I think that Harvey’s hurt a lot worse than we’re lead to believe, and they’ve tried mercilessly to protect him all year), and Whittingham is a great coach. I love Bronco, I think he’s the fit for our program, but I would have been equally happy with Whitt at the helm.
I hope we win… I’ll be staying up late in Baghdad to watch the game, but I worry….
Darkbull and true blue – good points. Enough with the speed and being flat and not showing emotion. I have no doubts the team will prepare as hard as they possibly can and leave it all on the field. In the end the best team that day will win.
Darkbull thanks to you and all the others who are spending their Thanksgiving serving our country. I assume that is why you are in Baghdad having to stay up late to watch the game. As I sit with my family in the comfort of our home my prayers will be with you and all the rest. Of all the things we have to be thankful for this year there are few things less important than what you are doing for us.
Go Cougars.
Sorry – “MORE” important.
Question:
Kyle Whittingham has earned the reputation of being a good “big-game” coach, right?. Well, I am just wondering…
Is it Kyle Whittingham or was it Gary Anderson ???
So far, the utes have played 2 “big-games” this year (Oregon & TCU) and they have lost both. I think everyone was expecting TCU-UTAH to be a close game based on Whitt’s “big-game” reputation but it didn’t turn out that way at all. In the last few BYU-UTAH games it seems it has been the utah defense that has really shined. Think about the ‘05-’08 games. It’s been a creative ute D playing awesome against a great BYU O.
I know Whitt is a defensive guy and all but I’m just wondering – How much will the U miss Gary Anderson?
Just some food for thought.
Just to clarify, since I was one of those that implied that Shawn was a troll, that, yes, I am self-deceptive (smile).
I am, however, also aware that BYU could lose. We’ve been burned too many times in the recent past when we’ve played the U (and it is miserable dealing with Utah fans afterward). It does seem like Utah comes with more emotion than we do, which has really frustrated me. However, reading Quinn’s post above made me realize that it isn’t just emotion that wins games (otherwise USU would beat us more often). BYU has won by being composed even though the Utes were playing wild. It is unlikely that BYU would have won in 2006 and 2007 if we had been playing wild. One of the reasons I think that we lost last year was because Max started playing wild.
When all is said and done, I know that we all want BYU to destroy Utah. Once the games actually starts on Saturday, that’s all that really matters…
Go Cougs!
Holy geeze Batman,!!!!
Shawn was just expressing HIS opinion. He did not curse and used respectful terms. He even hopes he Is wrong. I do too, (hope he’s wrong)….
Sorry, Dracos, This will probably be the melt down for Max…. Hope I’m wrong.
But if history repeates itself ….you do the math.
Go cougs…. I hope it not a long Saturday…I hope my negative thoughts are wrong also…
But Shawn hit some hot buttons for us all….if not the group would not have reacted as they did.
If diversity is “trollish” then I’m the head Troll….
I said it last year and I’ll say it again. There is nothing holy abou this game. It is not a “holy war.” It’s church vs state if anthing. There is nothing holy about the yewts. They are a dirty team,that was evident in the TCU game. Even when they didn’t draw a flag, they were constantly in the ear hole of a TCU player (any TCU player), and I bet they weren’t wishing him good luck. If you don’t believe me, go back and watch the film. I haven’t seen all of Utah’s games, so I don’t know if this happened all year or if this is what happens when they are loosing. They are dirty and I hope they get buried Saturday!
Witt-I whole heartedly agree with you!
I joke around that unfortunately, the only red in my house is the small “U” on our college diplomas. If I weren’t proud of our education (not necessarily the school), we wouldn’t even have that! We bleed blue.
Being a Ute, even if only for a year, made me more proud to be a Cougar. I hate the Utes. And I’m not too ashamed to admit it. My heart literally start pumping a little harder and my head spins a little bit thinking about them.
Somebody else said this, and I am going to say the same thing: I’m not at all nervous for Saturday, I am just anxious. I wish we could skip Thanksgiving because all of that hoopla is just in the way of what I am really focused on.
Go Cougs!
Oh, and Darkbull, I hear what you’re saying, and I mostly agree, excpet that, I do not think that BYU loses because they play flat, or that fire and emotion will win them the game. I do think, though, a loss would be much less disappointing if the team would put up a fight and show some emotion. They play, they start loosing, and they just hang their heads, and that is frustrating. I want to see some rally in them, even when they are down 38-7 to an obviously better team.
And, like others, I am assuming you are in the service being in Afghanistan. Thank you, thank you! My husband is a nurse at the VA Med Center and serves our veterans everyday. My heart goes out to all of our military. I really am proud of you and appreciate what you are doing in the Middle East! I hope you go to bed Sunday morning in the wee hours with a smile on your face.
I hope you and Shawn are wrong Pizza. I can’t take another loss, and I hope for Max’s sake he doesn’t have a meltdown. If he does he will not be remembered for his record number of wins but for his mega-melt-downs against the Utes.
Zoo, you mentioned something that I have long believed to be true. I do not believe that Kyle Whittingham is a “big game” coach all the Utes claim he is. I have always felt that Anderson played a big role in his success (that and some luck at just the right times.) I can remember just a few short years ago when the U was struggling a little bit and Utes were beginning to stir about him. I also find it quite ironic that he and a good portion of his coaching staff are ex-cougars and even ex-graduate assistants at the Y. They have to be internally conflicted about their newly found hatred for the Y.
I have also been nervous about this game this whole year. Similar to how I felt against OU, FSU, and TCU. At least we got one of those wins.
Unlike those games, I am feeling more and more confident as the game gets closer.
Go Cougs!
to: pizzaman
so history goes only back to 2008? . . . what about 2007 when Max led us back to an awesome victory when it looked as if all was lost
I don’t know what it is about many Cougar posters that they don’t remember the full record or actually look at the facts. I refer back to the “Bronco’s Perspectus” posting when I got into it with a few posters over Max Hall “not winning the big game” and not being as good as past BYU QBs.
I like what Robbie Bosco said recently, which was essentially that Hall is one of the great QBs . . . he has won big games and his win record is against tougher competition than himself, Young, Detmer, etc. faced.
We just are focused on the whipping we took at Utah last year and Max’s 6 turnovers in that game. If we had beat FSU and/or TCU – all would be forgiven. If we beat Utah tomorrow, all will be forgiven I suspect. I sure hope so.
ditto to those giving thanks for those serving in military.
It is a blessing that so many have sacrificed so much so that we can have freedom and the abundance we enjoy, which result in us having time to drivel on about “the holy war” (which I really love to do).
This football stuff is fun, but the real wars aren’t. I have a son in the USMC. I wish he was home to go the game with me and my other boys tomorrow. I also have a boy on a mission. I am thankful for their sacrifices and pray for them and all the others serving.
Thanks everyone for your thanks. Stinks being away from home, but I do get to see a couple of BYU games! (Thanks to Kiyoshige who found out that the Armed Forces Network scheduler dude was Mormon and got him to get BYU games on!!! I always knew you were the best OB/GYN in the ARMY!)
Now, after all my critiques, I’ve got my BYU mojo on, and I’m looking forward to seeing BYU crush, destroy, demolish and beat the poopoo (see, now I’m getting nasty!) out of Utah. Want to hear my favorite Utah joke? Why didn’t they do a nativity scene at the U. of U. last year? Because they couldn’t find 3 wise men and a virgin…
The game’s on delay here tomorrow morning, so I’ll be in a news blackout until 11am Sunday (3 am Utah time) and hiding from my fellow soldiers who will get nothing but happiness out of telling me the score!!!
GO COOGS!!!!
Hey Quinn, was that close enough for you?
Good game. We almost blew it in the 4th quarter. Hall’s post game comments will no doubt keep the guys on 1280 busy for a week and Gordon Monson will get 3 articles out of it, but I think Max spoke what a lot of us thought after last years game. The Ute players and fans were total jerks before and after that game. They deserved what they got but they’ll probably get us next year when we’re the team in rebuilding mode.
Darkbull,
That’s an interesting story about AFN carrying the BYU games. During my deployment, I sent an email to the Armed Forces Network requesting as many BYU football games as they would carry. I cut and pasted the email thread below.
The rest of the deployment all of the guys in my unit wondered why BYU got more AFN air time than Notre Dame, USC, Michigan, Florida, Alabama, etc. I just had to chuckle and enjoy watching my Cougars.
Ki
MAJ Izu…it’s on the schedule, sir.
Best Regards,
Fellow BYU Alum
SFC Gary L. Qualls, Jr.
Affiliate Relations NCOIC
AFN Broadcast Center
On 9/10/2006 9:11:10 AM, you said…
Jerry Izu (jerry.izu@us.army.mil)
Iraq
Thank you so much for carrying the BYU Arizona football game last week.
Please, please, PLEASE broadcast the BYU-Boston College game (on ESPN2
this coming Saturday the 16th).
Sincerely,
MAJ Jerry Izu
Tikrit, Iraq
MVP = DEFENSE!
Dracos,
While I’m not totally in maxs corner yet, he did the things that I have been looking for in a senior leader. I was impressed with the timely runs for the 1st downs.
That’s leadership, that sparked the O and the D to play better….
Logan had a great game.
Pendleton is going to be a stud. Awesome game…. They need to send him more as his speed to the QB will yeild more sacks than other LB….
Chambers was amazing….
Pitta was double and trippled all game. Way to play strong….
I’m very happy with the win.
Go Cougars….
And congrats to TCU for running the table. That’s tough to do in any league or division.
Hope they get a shot at the NC. Go Frogs.
Very pleased with the win. Cannot believe how flat footed offense was in 2nd half. Sort of scary how inept they were at moving the football for a first down after the 3rd quarter touchdown.
Cannot believe Hall’s comments at the end. Good thing we won, but wow, it’s like the Zidane headbutt. More wild than composed there…
Now lets hope Texas loses to Nebraska, TCU plays for the title and the rest of the bowl eligible MWC teams go out and win their bowl games.
I find it amazing that Hall’s legacy really came down to one pass tonight. He didn’t have a great game and played not to lose (which usually doesn’t work, but it did tonight.) He honestly looked a like a deer in the headlights for much of the game but he put it where it needed to be and made a HUGE play! I’m happy for George. He is one of the best tight ends in the country and he has lived in Pita’s shadow for a long time. It’s good that we can always fondly remember him for this.
Hall’s comments were in the heat of the moment. Honestly, it was a year of frustration and pent up emotion. I don’t fault him or blame him. I actually found them refreshing. Every BYU player feels that way about Utah and every Utah player feels that way about BYU. He may have gone a little far when he said the “institution” but I’m ok with him calling out the Ute football team, fans and program.
Go Cougs!
As a Max Hall fan I have to say this:
In his senior year Max is 2-1 against ranked foes (btw, did everyone see with Oklahoma did to Oklahoma State today?!). That is something that I don’t think any other BYU quarterback can say.
His beautifully threaded pass to George, given the overtime situation and the intensity of the game, ranks up their with Beck to Harline, Austin 4:18, etc. Way to gouge out the hearts of Utah fans for the third time in four years…
Most importantly BYU beat Utah. I give the win mostly to the Defense, NOT Max, BUT in the end he did what was necessary to win the second “Big” game of his senior year. I am happy to rank him with the Greats of BYU.
I can now relax and look forward to the bowl game.
Loved the game, thought for a while that the Coug’s had an opportunity in the 3rd quarter to put the nail into the Utes. Again Utah claws back into this game, but BYU’s defense comes up big at important times, including the OT.
Jan was a stud, and Brian Logan for only being 5-6 is playing his heart out! I’m sure you guys on this site will be happy that the Cougar defense played so well tonight.
As for Max’s comments. Oh well! Ute fans delight in making a mountain over a mole hill when any BYU player says anything that isn’t prim and proper. Screw Ute fans who get self righteous over this issue!
BYU fan’s have put up with their crap for YEARS. I lived in Salt Lake when I was growing up, and I dealt with a number of low life haters, that really didn’t care about their worthless team at that time, but cared more about beating BYU.
Most BYU fan’s that grow up outside Utah, do not understand the intense hatred that Ute fans have towards BYU. Many times players from California or Arizona have no clue why BYU (SLC) fans hate the Utes and vice versa.
Nevertheless, I’m married to a Ute fan, have family that are Ute fans, and I do disagree with Max with the entirety of his statement. I do give him some leeway though, it was in the post-heat of the moment, and I’ve heard some pretty stupid comments from coaches allot older then Max. But I guarantee some Ute fans and Kyle will make more of this then it really is for next years game. Expect an Ugly display of sportsmanship by Ute fans next year in RES.
Loved the comment by Max. finally somebody is not politically correct. he will get talked to by Bronco but, he is a Sr. It is amazing how we tried to lose that game though. we had a two touchdown lead going into the 4th and we nearly blew it! but man what a finish!
Drakos,
I hope that on further reflection, you don’t think that Max’s comments were justified. He’s 24, he’s a returned missionary, and he’s had to work under an amazing amount of pressure for a kid his age. Thus, I wouldn’t castigate him for the emotion of the moment. However, I do hope that he follows up with an apology. There are a lot of quality athletes at the U. of U., Kyle Whittingham and Kalani-Sitake are quality coaches, as I’m sure other coaches at the U. are, and he should feel bad.
I got beer thrown on me at RES my senior year and laughed about it (we kicked their butts that year); I understand he’s protective of his wife and family, but he’s got to get a thicker skin… it has to come with the job.
Beyond that, kudos to Anae sticking a little longer with the run… the o-line was inspired and gave Harvey some huge holes. The LBs played inspired, eating up anything that went to the edges. J. Pendleton was inspired, making some awesome plays… and most of all, I have to say that game ball should go to Brian Logan. He had a great game. Go COOGS!!!
Looking back at my first comment on this post, I think the LBs really stepped up with the beserkness. DBs were sound. To be honest, I think Wynn made them look better than we are since he overthrew so many of his receivers downfield.
I think Max and Anae both overcompensated for their “mistakes” or “lessons learned” from last year. Max was determined to have ZERO turnovers. Anae showed that he would ride Harvey until he couldn’t walk anymore.
Dark, as for Max’s comments I think it helps to take them in context. He was asked about how this win feels after taking the brunt of so many Ute jokes and being ridiculed for his performance last year. So he responded with something not politically correct, and maybe a little bit off the handle. I would give you the same argument: Just as beer on your family “comes with the job”, I would venture that outrageous media comments and opinions “come with the job.” Anyone who is offended or thinks they’re inappropriate needs to get thicker skin…
P.S. Would much rather Max show some indiscretion in the media room than on the field trying to throw it into Robert Johnson who was double covering Dennis and McKay the whole night.
Great game. I was fortunate enough that they did overtime on our side of the field and I was able to see George go straight into the end zone. It was amazing seeing him catch it and have a free run into the endzone.
I totally understand Max Hall’s comments. Playing rugby for BYU a few years ago and whenever we played against Utah. The players would play extremely cheap and dangerous. I dislike Utah’s fans, teams, and school as a whole, but not individually. Individually I could care less, but as a whole its quite straining.
My brother-in-law who is from Salt Lake was telling me how much he hates Utah. He mentioned on how they are so many anti-mormons out there, so maybe that is what Max experiences are like.
Harvey had a great game, but Defense should be MVP. Maybe Pendleton ought to get it. Tough to pick just one.
Kudos to UU defense too. There game plan was a repeat of last year and they did a good job of shutting down the passing lanes and having four tipped passes. I’m glad Max didn’t let it get to him too much and throw INTs.
We all know that there are many good Ute alum/fans (such as President Monson), but some of them really are “classless”. I attend every home game at LES and only the Utes are rude enough to yell profanities during the pre-game prayer.
I watched to see if any Ute fans were getting abused and didn’t see any. I even complimented some of them on having a good team. We need to show them how to have a rivalry with good sportsmanship.
And, Hall had his second worst outing of his college career and it was still good enough to get the job done (thanks largely to defense!) Congrats to all the Cougs. Now, go get one more!
one more thing
I’m not sure what I would have said at Max Hall’s age if my wife and parents had been so abused. I wish he wouldn’t have said what he said, but I can’t blame him too much. I’ve said plenty in life and regretted it (even if partially true).
Jon,
When did you play rugby for the Y (I played 93-96)? I agree that he probably has good cause to be ticked at U. players and fans doing stuff on and off the field to him and his family (I hope his phone number is unlisted), but it would be great to see him show a little more poise, at least with the media. With his buddies and in the locker room, let his hatred fly, you know others are thinking and feeling the same way, but the truth of the matter is that there are lots of U. alum who are gen authorities, and he’ll be going to church, if not now, then some day with guys who went to and maybe even played for the U., and he doesn’t want that quote as the legacy that follows him around.
When you’re out of the context of each game, and look at what Max accomplished over his BYU career, he was/is a great college QB. Unfortunately I think that his size and some of his weaknesses will keep him out of the pros (I hope I’m wrong, because I love his work ethic and his attitude about the game–he’d be a great guy to have as a teammate to push you).
I’ll continue to bask in the glory of a great Cougar win… I wish I had my flag here this time, I’d fly it over the camp all week!
One more thing,
True Blue, I completely agree with your sentiments about Max’s comments. Fortunately, most of mine weren’t on ESPN and in the news. That’s the tough thing about his position. I doubt I would have behaved better, but unfortunately Max is and should be a role model (a la Charles Barkley).
The debate will go on and on about how our players should get up for the big games. I still, after all has been said and done fail to realize how our boys can seem (if that is the word) to come out flat for the FSU game,last years TCU game,seeingly Utah is way more excited and play’s withh a lot more passion (this year being an exception) and I know I am generalizing but it just has seemed like the Y has come out so much and played the game without emotion. Emotion (in part) fuels the mind to play above and beyond normal ability IMO. Over the years it seems like our teams just don’t have that extra drive in various games. It’s like football isn’t the most important thing in our players lives… and it shouldn’t be I agree… but when you step on that field it’s time to focus on one thing only…FOOTBALL
I know that I am being way to simplistic in my words…but damn… it just seams when you have put so much out all year long…all your life…for the game you step out on the field and have 65,000 crazies watching you man how coluld you not lay it all out on the field. I know our players are as a general rule better grounded in what life is really about but to me that should give us an advantage when understood correctly. I feel I’m just rambling on but we should be able to band together better than other teams in the good cause…and we have seemed to disappear in way to many big games. I am sure it is hard week in and week out but when you love what you do come game day???? Utah BSU Hawaii and others have been able to bust into the
Bull Crap Series..we all know things have to fall just right bla bla bla bla In reality the Y should be there more than any other NQ so it is frustrating. I know great recruiting is happening and the future looks better, but we still have to not let these letdowns or whatever they are continue year to year.
Also what about Omar’s program? Is it being continuely updated. He could help out some on our speed and quickness issues.
Also talking to Jake’s mother Kelly she told me there wasn’t a good nutrition program for the team.
Quinn, Markell and Ben. Sorry for my rantings….Just frustrated and confused??? Other than that 4 10 plus seasons I’m still happy as a 10 handed monkey and Ben my daughter Lyndi say’s HI !
Thanks for an opinion.
Leave your response!
Categories
Archives
Meta
Good Info.
Most Commented