Season in “short review”: Offensive line
Let’s start this off where the game starts, and that’s with the Big ‘Ol Boys up front. Like every other position on Offense this veteran group came into the season riding a roller-coaster of hype. So how did they deliver? Aside from the trip to Ft. Worth, the OLine played well all year. They were consistent in the run game and gave Max a great pocket. The only let down for me this year was that in 2005 and 2006 we had an OL that would get the 2-3 yards WHENEVER we needed it. This group got it most of the time, but there were a couple times we really needed it, and couldn’t get it. Overall I would say on the year that these guys lived up to the expectations that were placed on them.
So What’s Next?
Travis, Dallas, Ray and Oswald are all headed to greener pastures so what do we have in the cupboard, in the form of a dominant OLine? Great news for Cougar fans is that the QB protector, aka Left Tackle, is an outstanding freshmen named Matt Reynolds and we get him back. The news gets better…we have two RM Guards in the form of Terrance Brown and RJ Willing who have plenty of starting experience that will also be back in the lineup. I believe that Ryan Freeman will also be back off his mission and if that is the case he will be a strong candidate for the starting Center job. Or possibly look for Coach Weber to move Terrance to Tackle and let Freeman play Guard.
By Markell Staffieri
That is good to hear. The O-Line seems to determine the teams success mor than most people give it credit for. I am glad to hear that we do have options with experience.
I think we will see some growing pains with the new O-line but they will end up being a solid unit. We’ll probably have some big talented lineman signing up on LOI day which will be good. This will be a big test for Coach Weber to see how well he can get our new O-line prepared. These guys will play a huge role in the success of our offense next season.
Quinn & Markell,
Thanks for taking the time to give us your insights. This blog has been the best part of my cougarnews addiction. I have a couple of ideas for you guys to mull over for future entries to help us wannabes, neverweres and Uncle Ricos understand what it was like to be part of a big time team.
1. How important is emotion prior to and during a game for a college football team? I know that it is impossible to be up for every game, but after playing ball since 9 yrs old, does emotion turn into points on the scoreboard in the college game?
2. How big is team chemistry? Was that a factor in this year’s very fine, but less than spectacular season?
3. What are some of the advantages/disadvantages of simple, execute at a high level offense/defense as opposed to keeping your opponant off guard by applying new wrinkles against old foes?
Keep up the great work with the blog! Go Cougs!
IS the O-Line Important? Alabama seems to think so after the Sugar Bowl.
If there’s an area where BYU has been consistently good over the years, it’s the offensive line. It’ll be tough to replace this line, but it’s not like their successors will be complete newbies. I know I saw Willing and Brown out there this year. There’s also Garrett Reden, who has some game experience.
Ryan Freeman should be back from his mission in the spring. Here’s to hoping he can be game ready, but I thought it was his brother Mark who’s played some center in the past.
I don’t know much about Nick Alleto, but he’s played some.
A quick glance at the roster shows Jon Barrett, who’s smallish at 6-0 and weighs almost 330 lbs (what do they feed these kids coming out of Timpview?!?!), though he looks short on experience.
Rick Wolfey has game experience on the d-line, but I recall him being recruited as a promising o-lineman.
The good news is that we won’t be working from scratch. I hope that the new unit can come together quickly, because OU and FSU are going to be challenges.
the o line was solid not great, but in their defense on a lot of the sacks and fumbles max held onto the ball way to long
The road to the MWC Champ runs down I-15
So I have been doing some thinking and I have come to the conclusion that BYU and Utah OWN the MWC (in football). The two schools have won every MWC but 2 this decade.
The teams are so dominate that in order to win they have to beat eachother. Basically the rivalry always decides the MWC Champ these days, so they really should no longer be separate goals.
2008: Utah (beat BYU)
2007: BYU (beat Utah)
2006: BYU (beat Utah)
2005: TCU (beat Utah and BYU)
2004: Utah (beat BYU)
2003: Utah (beat BYU)
2002: CSU (beat BYU…Utah?)
2001: BYU (beat Utah)
I’ve come to realize how important the center is in the O-line. Although our O-line was good this year, I think we missed Sete a bit. Whoever is center next year will need to step it up to be as good as the past two years. We will need the center to call the right protection and recognize the blitzes that OU and FSU will surely bring. FSU just dominated Wisconsin – yes, I’ve dogged the Big 10 this whole year, but still they were impressive. They return almost everybody – I think their QB was a sophomore.
Does TCU ever get BYU and Utah at home in the same year? BYU and Utah I think alternate getting both teams at home. Every year TCU has to beat one of us on the road. Just a little bit of conspiracy working for us every other year, yeah??? In that respect, TCU is kind of the red-headed step child (no offense Andy Dalton) of our conference.
Offensive Line is one of the most important aspects of any teams chances of success. Though I’d say that having a well balanced defense maybe more important, offensive line is a close second.
One word of warning to Cougar fans..One of the reasons for Gary Crowtons demise was due to the bare cupboard that Lavell left as he retired in 2000. In 2001 most of our line were Sr’s, and there was a big hole in our offensive line pipeline. It quickly caught up to us, as our QB’s were pummeled by opposing defenses.
I do think Bronco and staff realized that issue and have addressed it, but you never know how new O-lines will gel, and they are going to have to grow up in a big hurry with Oklahoma and Florida State up first next season. I guess TCU’s defensive speed won’t surprise anyone by the time they play them next season.
Will be interesting.
Kiyo,
Good insight on the TCU scheduling. Guess that’s what happens when you join the conference late. I think that if those 3 teams continue to be at the top they need to switch it up so that it is like a round robin with each team getting on of the others home and one away. I am going to hate every even year because we have to go on the road to TCU and Utah.
We are going to need more than just a good center if we want to start out 3-0 next season. I think we got Fresno States coach to work our schedule this next year.
Oline was solid across the board but not spectacular(considering the hype). I agree with the Sete post I liked Sete’s aggresiveness/nastiness. I loved watching him lay on top of Utah players and roll around. I thought for sure he was going to get flagged a time or two against utah for unsportsmanlike conduct. He did get more then his share of flags that year.
Speaking of TCU’s speed against our offensive line, why was this such a factor this year and not in previous years? Are Jerry Hughes and the rest of the TCU d-line this year really that much faster than Blake and Ortiz were in ‘07?
In ‘06 and ‘07, the o-line did its job against TCU’s speed. Fans and the media hail the size and talent of the o-line. Then in ‘08, the line crumbles against TCU’s speed. Fans and the media trash the o-line as a bunch of overweight, slow white guys.
The difference perplexes me. I mean no disrespect to TCU’s D, which had a stellar year outside of the OU game, but was this truly just about speed, or did TCU do something different up front this year?
My understanding is that TCU watched a lot of film and came up with a new defensive approach against us this year. Everybody else we faced learned from that game. So it’s not so much that the O line was different from last year as that teams played them differently. That’s why the offensive brain trust needs to go back the drawing board a little bit before next year.
We did have a good year on the OL but I believe it will get even better as we start to get more lean OLs at BYU. I hope this will be improved during the next few years. I would really like to see Braden Brown converted to an OT but that is just me.
So here is my two deep for OL next year:
LT: Reynolds, Speredon
LG: T. Brown, Reden
C: Willing, R. Freeman
RG: Taufi, Alleto
RT: Reden, Hansen
Willing has been taking a lot of snaps at center and despite having a OT frame, I believe he will be the front runner for the 1st string center. Terrance Brown and Jesse Taufi are almost locks to be the starting Guards next year. Matt Reynolds is obviously the starting LT. The one position that is really up in the air for me is RT. Reden, Alleto, Speredon and Hansen are all really talented. Reden is extremely versatile and could see time at various positions across the OL. Hansen is the most talented but is just getting back from his mission and it is just too early to predict how he will respond.
There is a nice amount of talent and versatility on this line and Reynolds, Brown and Reden all have starting experience. The key will be the adjustment of Willing to the line calling responsibilities of center.
@RobbC,
Yeah, the offensive brain trust would be foolish to think that teams won’t adapt to our offense. I don’t have the defensive understanding to see exactly what TCU was doing, but it sure provided the remaining teams on the schedule with a blueprint for trying to shut down our offense. It worked for the teams that had the ability to implement it.
Did the O-Line underachieve this year? Yes.
Will we miss them greatly next year? Yes!
Max Hall is NOT cool and collected under the pocket with a heavy rush. He turns over the ball, almost every time.
BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR…
BYU has always been known for its Ginormous OL. We have a reputation of being the most physical team that people play all year. This is because we used to punish people with the run. We would rush for about 50 yards in the first half, mix in some passes to move the ball and then by the middle of the 3rd quarter our physical play would wear Defenses down and we would run the ball to win the game.
You may think that our OL is not Fast enough or Quick enough, but don’t Speed cloud your thoughts. I said this in TCU week, but I’m going to say it again. My favorite Quinn Gooch quote on stopping speed, “When you hit him hard enough, they stop running fast.” If we would line up and RUN the ball with Powers, Leads, Stretch plays where our OL can ATTACK and PUNISH then we would have been able to ram it down the Toads throats like we did Utah’s D line (Anyone see how fast Utah’s D was against Ala?)
I don’t think getting slimmer faster OL is the answer. The answer is gettin back to basics. Run plays that Attack. Here is the problem:
1) We didn’t run the ball enough
2) When we did run, the RB’s danced around too much
3) The Run plays were Zone run plays that ask the OL to sustain blocks for a long time at the LOS not attacking downfield (This type of run game is better suited for a QUICK RB like Staley who can wait for a hole then explode)
4) We did not attack defenses by lining up, pulling someone and telling the RB, get behind the big train, or in Travis Bright’s case…the Elephant!
Remember you have to get the tough yards when you need them and that comes from a big OL, not a fit OL. In the glory days, BYU could run the ball. Texas Tech was not on the national scene until the started to run the ball. BYU will not beat OU, FSU, Tulane, TCU or Utah unless we wear them down and just beat the crap out of them up front.
Markell-
It’s hard for me to comprehend how you think that the offensive line, “aside from the trip to Ft. Worth, the OLine played well all year. They were consistent in the run game and gave Max a great pocket.”
Stink! Collie’s entering the draft.
http://www.sltrib.com/ci_11411725
Walt,
Please explain your thoughts. Remember I said they played well, not Great. And I stand by the fact that they were consistent throughout the year. Considering the hype they underperformed. By they were surely above average for an OL unit.
Markell,
You were spot on. The run game was good, but when we needed some first downs on fourth and short at CSU, we were denied by a subpar defense. Again at SDSU, we made that horrible run defense look like the Baltimore Ravens’ defense.
It seems like there is a difference in play between Grimes and Weber. I think Grimes got more out of his line than Weber is getting out of this one. This was arguably one of the most talented lines at BYU and in the country, but sure did not play like it. They are all great talents, but just did not click on all cylinders when they should have been able to do so.
I’m willing to bet that you and Quinn cringed a lot when watching the Defense this year as well. It was disheartening how they were able to make average QBs look like Joe Montana on every play. As a whole, we did not get any real pressure on the QB, we could not cover our routes, and we some how gave up consistent long balls while having a perpetual ten yard cushion.
Markell or Quinn, who do you expect to really emerge next year?
I suspect that Brandon Bradley will really come into his own, and I think that Howard can emerge into a Justin Robinson type of role, where he was undersized, but utilized his game experience to the fullest.
I don’t anticipate a change to a 4-3, but what was it like for both of you to switch from the 3-3-5 to the 3-4?
Staff:
I think that you are missing the point. I am not saying that we need to go Denver Broncos style and be undersized. I am just saying that I am sick of playing 5 OGs across the line and not having quick enough Tackles to stay with speed rushers. We have a lot of talent on the OL but a lot of times it seems that they come to BYU and immediately put on 30 lbs of fat in the midsection.
Jake Kuresa is a classic example. He was at least 30 lbs above his ideal playing weight and he said as much when he finished his senior year and started training for the NFL draft. He lamented not having been leaner during his 4 years at BYU and talked about how it affected his play and his draft status. He would have been just as strong at 310 Lbs as opposed to 345. I would just rather have OTs that are in the 6′7″ and 295 lbs range that are more athletic. That quickness is needed in the college game against 230 lbs DEs.
I think that the coaches are going that direction. Matt Reynolds is much more lean than his brother. And most of these big Polynesians are naturally strong. I just don’t think that they need the gut to be effective. Xavier Sua’filo, Braden Hansen, Brad Wilcox, and Michael Yeck are the types of OTs that we need going forward. All these guys are currently in the 6′6″ about 260 lbs range and will be able to just put on muscle at this level to be lean, quick and strong without being oversized.
Simply put, when you have 5 OGs who are all 330lbs you become easier to defend because you are only capable of doing one thing. When every guy on your OL projects as a OG in the NFL, you have a problem.
I want to see these Oline stay big and get faster too but I think if BYU can get together and work as a team they can be great. Next year will be a great year with at least 9 wins so I hope that we can make the most of what we are blessed with like we always do! Thanks for sharing all this great stuff!
MattC-
You hit it right on the money! To Markell, Quinn & Staff, Alabama’s OL was huge and look what the Utes defense did to them…it was lights out! I have been telling you all year that the Niners & Broncos had undersized OL’s by NFL standards and yet ran the ball effectively, especially the latter, who led the league in running almost every year with no-name RB’s. Next year’s OL will be slightly smaller but better.
Markell, anytime a player or unit does not play up to expectations, no matter how good he/it plays, it is not good. This year’s (08) OL was the equivalent of a senior QB and they did not get it done when it counted (TCU, Utah & Arizona).
Finally, a word about speed: in drivers Ed they preach that speed kills; in football it does also! It’s great to have heart and have position mastery, but if you add on speed…it’s Hammer time…”can’t touch this!”
Walt I am not sure if we are trying to say the same thing two different ways or if we just need to agree to disagree. Smaller is not the answer. Fitter is the answer. Jake Kuressa was over weight because he was fat, not because he was big. (kind of like how I was 240 fit at BYU and felt great, no I am a fat 240 and feel like a slob). Travis Bright is Big, Eddie Kehl was big, Scott Young was big. Those guys were not fat guys, just big strong guys and they all moved really well.
It also depends on what kind of team you want to be. So we want to be the BYU of the last 4 years and pound the ball? Or do we want to be Texas Tech, Oklahoma, Texas, etc. If it is the former, keep ‘em big (just fit), if it is the latter, then by all means get your 290 lb quick guys.
As a side note to big and fat…Bryan Kehl was never more than 235 at BYU. Now he is playing at 250 and feels like he can put on more weight, because he is not fat, just lean muscle. Trust me, nobody would complain if we had 5 Eddie Kehl’s across the OL.
PS: I don’t think you can compare a senior unit to a senior individual. Especially when you had a Freshmen playing for the first time and a new signal caller in the middle. Playing center is a lot different than playing tackle. With all the communication that goes on and teams doing different things, I don’t think you can say this unit was like a senior QB.
Markell-
Can you truly say that we pounded on TCU, Utah and Arizona? Did Alabama pound on Utah? Brady Poppinga, Cameron Jensen, and you pounded on people so does it all about weight?
My son just received his kids Sports Illustrated today and here is something interesting it has in it: “Time Flies – A lot has changed since SI Kids started 20 years ago – but not everything”: Average weight of an NFL offensive lineman: 1990 – 277; 1995 – 298; 2000 – 309; 2005 – 313; 2008 – 313; ours in 08 was 326.4.
The stud of last year’s OL was Travis; he was the strongest, at 313 he was right at the NFL average, I assume that he is one of the fastest/quickest & he and David had the smallest gut. It seems to me that he has the best shot to make it in the NFL.
Yes, I guess we are saying the same thing now that you say that the OL needs to be more fit and with less of a gut; overall more athletic.
Walt,
Good to know we are on the same page…
We abandoned the run vs TCU, yes we did run the ball well against Utah, no we didn’t run well against AZ. But I was talking in terms of BYU collectively over the past few years. In order to really pound you have to stick with the run. I think about the Texas drive where they kept running the ball against OSU and by the end of the drive the OSU D just wanted to be off the field. I don’t think the cared if Texas scored, so long as they didn’t have to line up and the ball ran at them again…you know what drive?
That is what we need to get back to doing. Just running, and running, and running, and then play action deep to McKay!
PS…the straight forward answer would be no we did not pound TCU…But I think our run game did pound Utah, it’s just a little hard to overcome 6 turnovers late in the game, so we had to start throwing, and then we turned it over so we had to throw and then we turned it over so we had to throw…(Should I just keep copying and pasting
)
I think what we are both saying here is that we need to be in better shape and we need to improve the run game so that Max doesn’t pass as much.
Markell-
What kind of an offensive system do we have? Is it a hybrid of Texas Tech’s and if so what is the difference?
One thing I have heard lately is that the Utes offense came together in the last 3-4 games because they went away from so much running and let Johnson open up the passing game. They beat us and the Tide thru the air, not on the ground. Over the past 3 decades we have primarily been known as a passing offense; some of our best years we could run also but our emphasis has always on the passing game. Even our great OL men who made it to the NFL were drafted primarily because of their pass blocking ability and experience.
So I think we do need to run but not to the extent that you are preaching.
Thanks for you expert analysis and insight.
Walt –
To be honest I am not sure what our offense is right now. When Coach Anae first came over it was the old Texas Tech, all run no pass…this was because we wanted to go back to the “Old BYU Football” which was all passing right? That is what I though too. Then after we got killed at SDSU I was riding home with Coach Reynolds and he was very upset with the play calling. In the Coach’s meeting he brought out all the stats from the “Glory Days” and showed everyone that BYU’s run pass was almost exactly 50/50.
I feel that Utah closed out the season so strong for two reasons. Defenses really had to respect their run and load up the box to stop it…that opened up the passing game, and what they did with the passing game is the real success. They threw short routes and managed the the game by nickel and diming the defense for 4-7 yards at a time. This is what our Offense was when John was the QB. We would hit short routes one after the other, run the ball and then when the time was right strike down field.
I hope that our offense goes back to short controlled routes and just sustained drives that wear teams out. The reason why I like the run game is becuase if you can wear a D down physically then you just dominate the end of the game.
I think that if you and I were Co-Offensive Coord. we would have the perfect balance.
Staff:
I completely agree on the fit comment. However, I don’t think that you can really be 330 lbs and fit. Like you said, Bright is the fittest of the group and is about 310. IMO, Feinga and Dallas Reynolds should have been about 20 pounds leaner.
However, my real question is about OL design and makeup. Do you really think that every position across the line should have the same body type and build? It is my opinion that the last five years at least has seen BYU play 5 OGs in body type across the line. IMO, that is not the most effective way to do it. You could be more physical with quick and agile OTs that can move and get to people on the second level. That is why I think next years line could be better; we should have more athletic and quick OTs. I personally would like to see converted TEs at OT.
Matt:
No, everyone should be the same across the board. I was just making the point that I would rather have more fit guys all the way across. The OTs should be taller, longer, quicker. The OGs should be a little bigger, maybe more leverage (shorter). Converting a TE to a OT is what they did with Reynolds and Kuressa. It is a GREAT idea.
The main thing is that if you can be heavier by being stronger (muscle weighs more than fat) you can be bigger and more agile. That is the best combo of all.
Walt…Just realized I said the old TT offense was all run no pass. I meant the opposite, but I’m sure you figured that out.
Markell-
Yes, I knew that and thanks again for your insight.
Staff-
This will be your first off season, spring camp & fall camp, what is your plan to keep feeding us with interesting stuff and do you need help with research on recruits and other information? I know that it was a big load on Quinn during the season so maybe you could reach out to alumnus, former players in order to lighten the load a little.
Thanks,
Walt
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